Oktavia Schreiner

We return with an interview with Oktavia Schreiner, known  to Scottish audiences for her painted ceramics which have been exhibited at Intermedia Gallery , 16 Nicholson Street and Kiosk Gallery, all in Glasgow, as well as Generator Projects in Dundee. Oktavia has also exhibited in the United States, at Mana Contemporary in Jersey City.  Of Course she has shown in her home country, recently premiering a large public  commission in Austria.  We spoke a bit about the process and context of Oktavia’s work.


How did your Process change with the increase in scale with the piece you presented in Austria, The Bigger Forest?

Oktavia: Yes, der größere Wald (the bigger forest) is my largest piece so far and it is my first permanent public art work. It is almost 6 meters high and I used one ton of clay to make it.  It does make quite a difference because I had to plan the sculpture completely beforehand. I was working with the steel company STAHL UND FORM in Vienna and we made a 3D Model beforehand. The painting changed on a large scale as well of course as I had to think about people seeing the piece from 100 meters distance and from close up, just standing underneath it. I knew beforehand that I would paint tree trunks on the columns to refer to the forest who used to be there, but I was a bit more free with the painting to make decisions right there when I had the sculptures in front of me. The difficulty with this piece was that I had to paint the sections individually as the drying, painting, glazing and firing process and time restraints required to work in shifts. But I think these restraints can sometimes add to the charm of a piece. Not having full control can be a good thing.

a large red and blue ceramic sculpture with steel supports and apartment buildings and trees in the background
Der größere Wald, Ceramic and-steel 2022, photo by Anna Rauchenberger

I think it is important to spend quite some time at the place where the sculpture will be placed and really understand the dimensions and the architecture around it. See it in different lights as well. I brought glazing tests to the locations and a ruler and just spent hours there.

BB: you must have developed some kind of relationship to the people in the apartments around it?

Oktavia: Yes, there was a couple opposite who were at the window the whole day. I don`t think it was particularly because of me. They just really liked looking out of the window. I never had a chance to talk to them though. The building behind the sculpture was just built when I developed my work, so no one lived in them yet. I am planning to go there again next week and see it more alive. There is a new build behind the sculpture but also a building that is probably a 100 years old opposite. I love that you can experience the piece with both backgrounds.

Blue and white ceramic spheres assembled on a wooden frame not unlike a christmass tree, inside a white gallery space with unvarnished wooden floors.
The invention of religion and the order of the planetoids ceramic and wood ,2021


BB: Especially with the piece on the invention of religion, there is kind of a chronological presentation of the images in glaze,  maybe a bit like a themed collections of glasses?

Oktavia: yes, this piece does a bit more storytelling.  what do you mean with collections of glasses?

BB: well the narrative isn’t presented in a strictly linear or chronological fashion, the order you view them in depends on where you approach the “tree” in the gallery

Oktavia: That’s the nice thing about sculpture. you can’t read it from left to right. I can make quite specific drawings but as it is part of a bigger sculpture it loses some of its narrative and I hope it makes it more open. The viewer has a lot of options to engage with it.

A close up photograph of one of the cermaic spheres in the previous photo, showing the painted surface which has an image of a doorway underneath a iron balcony, painted in blue on a white background. the other spheres are visible at the edge of the frame.
The Invention of religion , detail

BB: In your work the representational or figurative element is mostly contained within the painting or glaze, and then that is contextualized in sculpture, so there is kind of a flattering of time?

Oktavia: Flattering time. Especially because the process of making it is a long one. With ceramics there is a lot of planning involved. It has a certain rhythm. If you paint with slip for example you have to finish the painting before the clay has dried out. So there is a time constraint.

A ceramic column or tube with a landscape painted on it inside a white gallery space.
Hausberg_ceramic_180x40x40, 2017

BB: I was wondering if there is anyone you think is due for a critical reassessment? an artist you’d describe as underrated?

Oktavia: Oh, there are many. There are all these artists out there who make art passionately but never get to show it or never make any money from it. It is quite dark but also it is incredible that the artist’s drive to create is so strong. I’d like to think I would always keep going even when I had no chance to show my work to others or earn an income from it. Of course I hope I don’t have to.

 Camilla Vuarenmaa, a Finnish  painter. I got to know her while she lived in Glasgow for a couple of years or so.. As far as I can see from afar she has success in Finland, but it is a shame that she never got to show her work properly in Scotland even though she produced a lot of paintings here and lots of local stories went into her work.

Austrian painters Mischa Reska and Dieter Kleinpeter.

Oktavia: The architecture of tenement building and gasometers In Glasgow influenced the wooden structures of some of my work. People are influential. I find the art community very supportive here. Fellow artists and I are sharing our applications and trying to support each other with opportunities. That really helps.

Oktavia with her work for scale


BB: I also wanted to ask if you could think of a guilty pleasure,  something that you love but think is stupid.

Oktavia: Do you know the poem from Pam Ayres “I wish I`d looked after my teeth” That will be me as I have quite a sweet tooth Also I love watching  “the great pottery throw down’. But it is a bit awkward to admit that because the Program is really about participants who do pottery as a hobby. Especially with ceramic there is a hobby craft connotation to it anyway and in the fine arts there is often a need to distinguish oneself from that. But also I’m not too fussed about it. I think the programme is brilliant and I love watching the enthusiasm people have for clay.


for more information please visit https://oktaviaschreiner.com. or on instagram 


Interview by Benjamin Duax


Thomas Cameron

Our first interview of the New Year is with the Glaswegian painter  Thomas Cameron, who has recently exhibited at the New Glasgow Society and Taymour Grahne Projects, in London.  Thomas explores the quiet interior life of busy public places, His work is influenced by vernacular photography and kitchen sink realist cinema.

ButterBiggens:  The photos of the delivery guys and restaurant workers in Covid gear are interesting because they already seem like the distant past.

Thomas Cameron:  It’s interesting how they have become so much about a specific time, this wasn’t a conscious decision. I am more interested in the atmosphere and mood of the scene depicted, and will make different versions of the paintings to achieve this. For example the fast-food restaurants and supermarket paintings are painted quickly and loosely to capture a sense of speed and chaos. I’ll intentionally avoid references to specific landmarks, to try and keep the painting as ‘open’ as possible. This is also the reason the faces are often obscured, either by turning away from the viewer or in the way that i’ve painted them. I am more interested in signifiers for city life, and the fast-paced, detached way of modern life. 

3 Delivery 152x112 oil on canvas

I often play around with lighting and limited palettes to see how it changes how the scene comes across. Something about 5 guys has caught my attention because I’ve painted different locations by chance. But the specificity of the locations isn’t important in my work

14 Fast Food Interior 120x90cm

 I  usually try to avoid obvious landmarks or signifiers that make the painting about that specific space. Keeping it ambiguous hopefully allows it to be more relatable and recognisable.

BB: You changed the exposure, are you painting from your laptop then?

T:  I always print the images. I’ll usually make some minor edits on photoshop; cropping, colour and exposure adjustments. I then make oil studies on paper to figure out how the photograph translates to paint – what can be left out, and what kind of palette am I going to use. At this stage I am trying to figure out what exactly is interesting to me about the image, why did I take it and why am I drawn to paint it, before that the process is very intuitive. When making the larger paintings on canvas I will initially refer to that oil on paper study, as the photograph provides too much information.

13 Meat Shelves 152x112cm oil on canvas

BB: I thought it was kind of interesting to make such clean meat, the opposite of meat paintings by Chaïm Soutine or other people who make food look so goopy

T: I did have Soutine in mind when painting that. I really wanted to capture the sense of endless plastic packaging. I see these paintings as dealing with the same themes as my works of people in the city, despite their appearance. With these paintings I also wanted to capture this sense of the flaneur, wondering around the city, noticing the people, but then going into these shops and seeing something as mundane as a supermarket shelf of meat as if for the first time. I wanted the viewer to be interested in the way its painted, brushwork and colour, and to appreciate that first and foremost and the subject comes after. 

8 Supermarket 152x112cm oil on canvas

7 Descent Oil on canvas 152x112cm

BB: I was wondering if there were any recent exhibitions you’d seen that really stuck with you either online or in real life? 

T: The last exhibition I saw was Lucian Freud. I’ve really enjoyed rediscovering his work, particularly looking at his etchings and drawings which I wasn’t familiar with.  The Walter Sickert exhibition at Tate Britain was a highlight this year. I am often looking at his work in books so it was great to see so much of it in the flesh. In terms of contemporary painters I’ve enjoyed seeing this year include Caroline Walker, Eric Fischl and Jenna Gribbon. I also really enjoyed Mixing it Up: Painting Today at the Hayward Gallery, particularly Jonathan Wateridge, Lisa Brice and Gareth Cadwallader. I’m also really inspired by film, most recently Wong Kar Wai and Mike Leigh in particular.

BB: What about an artist or movement that you think of as a guilty pleasure? is there something you really like that you think is dumb?

T: Nothing immediately comes to mind, I try to look for inspiration in  everything, there is always something interesting to take from things that might not be obvious.

4 Fast Food 152x112cm oil on canvas

BB: like five guys for example, i actually was wondering if you actually eat when you go there, it occurred  to me that you might be a vegetarian.

T: Yes exactly. I did eat there after painting it a few times, and I am vegetarian.

BB:  Bit of a catch 22,  You want to paint the real lived reality, but then you’re kind of forced into eating these burgers over and over. I think it’s something a lot of painters struggle with.

T: These particular paintings were actually based on photos taken from the window. I quite like the idea of this detached gaze moving through the city.I want to be invisible in the images, so I wouldn’t paint an image where someone has noticed me and is looking directly at me. But also I want to protect their privacy. It also comes back to keeping the painting open.  

1 Street Scene oil on canvas 152x112cm low res

To see more of Thomas’s work please visit him on instagram at   @thomascameronart. Interview by Ben Duax,  January 2023 



Ross Andrew Spencer


“Security” , 90 cm x 170 cm , 2022

Ross Andrew  Spencer is a metallurgical alchemist based out of Edinburgh,  creating subtle process based abstractions out of  various construction materials and  pigments.  The paintings communicate time and memory in a kind of destructive performance that lasts for a long time after production has nominally ceased- the various materials continue to settle and react chemically to one another.

Please keep reading for a short profile.

Chat room conversation with Ross Spencer
Ross visited us early July to talk about his work


Butterbiggens Prize:

Do you call them paintings?

Ross Andrew Spencer:

They are paintings. Sometimes there is paint in them, sometimes I lay them flat so folks can walk around them. 

BB: When you lay them flat do people touch them? Like Richard Serra sculptures for example, I always want to put my fingers on. 

RS: They do! and kick them! i think they are trying to see if they are really made from the materials i say or not. Yeah I would be tempted to, just to see if the rust would come off onto my hand.

BB: And does it? you were talking about how they look like they could rearrange themselves, and I wonder if the tar melts , or the oxidation changes over time , Like abstract oil paintings with a thick facture, ones from the 50’s you can tell they look really different

RS: They change slowly they effervesce and oxidizes slowly and change long after completion. The lead is fairly inert to decomposition but in contrast the iron rusts quickly and the salt content in the cement slowly rises to the surface

BB: Could you explain a bit the actual physical process of constructing them

RS: The tar is an odd one as whenever it changes due to cold or heat it usually reverts back to its original state after a few hours:…When I’m at my most emotionally unstable that’s when I try to go and make the work. It comes together in moments of composure. i’m trying to charge the work with my emotions. You are imparting some of the distilled feelings and hoping it reacts. Similar to figurative animation, It’s a false sense of creating life. Lots of heating to very high temperatures and pouring both with the lead and tar. they can be unpredictable so i am constantly in a struggle to make i t form and shape the way i would like. The process is often a disaster but it’s the tussle I think makes the work. .

“Untitled” 240 cm X 120 cm, 2022

BB: You must have a lot of space? and with process based work like that, i guess you must have some duds, sometimes it doesn’t work, no?

RS: I work outside a lot, as the smoke alarms just don’t like my work. I make far more dud work than anything i am content with, i will always leave it and return when i am more up for a struggle with it. Sometimes it has changed itself especially if the weather is terrible.

BB: What led you here? like were you making more representational work at a certain point? 

RS: Yeah and I still do although less frequently. I realised that to make things in the way that I wanted I needed a method that would lend itself to being fought with. When I made work before I had a solid idea of what I was painting I was never satisfied that what I completed had what it should although it looked like what I set out to do. I wanted the painting to have more of a relationship with me that wasn’t just one sided. I wanted it to separate itself from being just materials and be able to change and in some way interact with me. That’s why I make large work as it holds its own and it struggles back. It won’t be defeated and manipulated easily. We engage physically, and I often lose. This probably could not be said of smaller, more delicate works. That’s the way in which I feel like I can impart my feelings into it. be it anger or fear or something else and it can give back by defying me. 

“Protection” 150 cm X 120 cm, 2022

 RS:Howard Hodgkin would turn work against the wall and come back months later in the hope that his mind set had changed. i’m hoping that both my mind set and the work has changed.

BB: that’s really a good move.I read that Ray Bradbury would put every finished story in a drawer for a year before doing a  second draft.

RS: I thought so too. I heard him say this in an interview and it really changed how I thought about my engagement with work. It really is a brilliant method as sometimes feels as though someone else might have written it and he was maybe less critical?

“Close to Me”, 140 cm X 90 cm, 2022

BB: And the work you did for the album cover, is there a direct relationship between the sound and the image, or structure?

RS: It was strange and brilliant making work for the album! I was also working digitally which threw me, but luckily there was a graphic designer working on the imagery too. Addie already liked a lot of the work I was making and was open to having me introduce this style into the record art. The result was digital images that look very sculptural. I ended up building “sets” and sculptures and piecing things together this way so there was still an element of unpredictability about the process.The intention is always for them to feel as monumental and overwhelming as emotions can be, even if they are small.

BB: Are there any exhibitions in Scotland or anywhere, or even online, that you’ve seen recently that really stuck with you?

RS: Rory McEwan exhibition at his family home Marchmont House in the Scottish BordeRS: in May of this year . I had very little knowledge of how talented and influential musician and artist he was. I had known about his perspex sculptures from art college, but knew very little else. As i have a tendency to do, I don’t spend enough time really looking and taking these exhibitions in. When I returned home and read more about him I wished I had spent longer listening and viewing his work.

BB: Last question, can you tell me a guilty pleasure? something that you love that you know is stupid or bad ?

RS: ASMR for sleeping…….. like rain sounds and whispering.

You can see more of Ross’s work at The Hook.

Interview by Ben Duax, July 2022

Daria Zapala



Sonic Womb

Wire, Plaster, Clay and Acrylic paint on Side Table 4.3H x 13W x 11.4D Inches

Daria Zapala recently graduated from the Glasgow School of Art with a Masters in Letters in Painting. In some cases working in Sculpture, Daria explores the three dimensional presence of colour as a representation of sound. In addition to recent exhibitions at SaltSpace and WASPS, both in Glasgow, Daria has shown work at the Los Angeles Contemporary Art Museum and Shrine Gallery in New York. We spoke with her last month about  her work in general and some of her influences.


Butterbiggens :

I want to ask you about the wire sculptures, in your statement you compare them to  scores, and i can picture,  like, Iannis Xennakis or the futurists or something, these big sharp lines over staff notation


Daria Zapala :

Those were actually inspired by  music scores made by John Cage, or Cornelius Cardew amongst few more. all of the works in the portfolio were made to be show together like a musical composition. So there were paintings, sculptures, drawings and sound.

The relationship between the sculptures and paintings is the fact that I was trying to set up a painterly syntax to all the research I have done. And at the beginning it was hard for me to visualize the sound as an object. Hence I reached out to sculpture as it is 3D, to help me understand how then I can make the paintings. I decided to focus on sound in general and distinguish it from the idea of music. I focused on my research on sounds I would hear in my studio especially while I was painting.


There is a fairly wide range of how literal the depiction of sound is, the synthesizer cables could easily be functional objects, “real” modular synth cables. 



Yes, The synthesizer cables. It was the latest idea that I added to my work.  I was still trying to think how I can present the idea of sound to a viewer. And the cables were just perfect. Especially those that lost their function when they were inserted into a wall. Then they were treated as sculptural pieces. I wanted the wall to reverberate as well but unfortunately the space where I was showcasing my research did not allow it. So now, I am planning to have the works shown again, hopefully this year, and I want to make sure that this time all the parts would be presented the way I planned.

I still only licked the surface of the connection between the colour and sound and I think there is a whole new avenue to discover. I would love to work with a musician or a composer, as I do not know much about sound from that perspective. There was a German physicist Hermann Helmholtz who was a pioneer in the scientific study of human vision and audition

He discovered that sound values: timbre, pitch and loudness correspond to colour’s brightness, saturation and hue. I want to use his theory and perhaps look more into Josef Albers theory of colour, Paul Klee as well and chromatic forms.


P.D. Ouspensky wrote about specific chords representing specific colours, with Albers, its this set of exercises, that will provide different results depending on the artists interpretation, like a score



Well, that is a good question. Because colour and sound both work with frequencies. And those can be measured. And that too, chords can represent specific colours.

I also follow the steps of artists that work in a similar field like Victoria Morton, Gerhard Richter and Pat Steir. My research was partially inspired by Daphne Oram works and Margaret Watts Hughes


What  about your 3D modeling work, and how it influences your paintings?


Well, I did sculpture when I was studying for masters degree in Poland. That was masters in printmaking and multimedia. Just recently I have returned to using 3D in my creative practice. I think it came along with a love for painting and also conducting sound research. It helps me to think and execute some of my ideas better. sometimes is just easier to make a 3D object in physical world than to paint it. I developed a lot of interest in how I can use sculpture in my practice. I have been considering welding and making those small wire sculptures on a bigger scale


it must be helpful to have that metaphor of the digital space to think of scale?


It definitely goes together with painting, twins Also it comes to thinking about the space as a sound as well. John Cage has used that. I think more and more artists realize that music and art go hand in hand.


what was the last painting exhibit you’ve seen that made a big impression?


Definitely the Victoria Morton show at the Modern Institure, Airds Lane. It could have been in January. There was a show of the GSA students at the RGI Kelly Gallery in February. There was this guy Murray Young. His figurative paintings were really good.

Pat Steir has a show now at the Gagosian Rome Gallery, very nice works.Steir’s new show is influenced by John Cage’s works

There is a great wee show at the Hunterian as well, Flesh arranges itself differently.


ok, I also try to ask people, if there is an artist they know about who they think is under rated, or that they would like more people to know about. Which  is a similar question to the exhibition question. I mean, someone people think is bad, or someone who never really got a day in the sun, who you like a lot?



can it be someone from a past? I love Mary Cassatt painting.

she worked under Degas. I don’t think she has been appreciated.

I am looking forward to the Burrell collection to be open. I think that is due .they have some great paintings in their collection, Degas especially


 I like to ask if you’d share with me, a guilty pleasure, can you tell me something, could be art or something else, that you know is bad/stupid, but that you love regardless?


That question! I was thinking about that. And I think it will be books. I buy a lot of books and on many occasions too many at once to read them all,  have usually like 5 books on the go and then I buy another one that I found interesting. I wish it was more of me, like another Daria or two so we can catch up with painting and reading and doing research etc..


For more information see www.dariazapala.com/


Interview by Ben Duax, April 2022

Natasha Kimstatsch

Temptations of St.Anthony, triptych 90×300 Totally divided by 3 canvas Oil on herringbone custom-stretched canvas

Natasha Kimstatsch  sent us paintings drawing from  Scottish history, Greek myth , slasher films and nudie magazines.  Recalling the films of George Kuchar or Kenneth Anger as much as préraphaélite painters, Natasha is based in Edinburgh. We spoke with Natasha  about her  work and its roots in alchemy.  Please click through for a short profile. 


Butterbiggens: lets start with  The Temptation of St Anthony.

Natasha Kimstatsch:

It is my one and only opus magnum, a classical form of cartoon when the story goes from one painting to another. The first one is called Tower of Babel, it is the pyramid growing out of  the spine while St Anthony is convulsively lying on a pictish star map depicting the star of Bethlehem. The second has frescos from Grantully chapel in Aberfeldy with pregnant angels and virgin nurturing a baby girl (from real life) where an apparition of Queen of Sheeba is tempting him with fake pregnancy. And third, when St Anthony overcomes temptations in form of colourful hallucinations gathers his power in cosmic or orphic egg, painted next to St Anthony chapel pointing to Christianity as final stop



Lots of subtle Scottish landscapes in these paintings, like the Calydonian boar hunt with Edinburgh castle in the background



Now Calydonian boar hunt, There is a sculpture of Calydonian boar in Florence where I lived.

I made a connection with Scotland as it is often depicted as a land of eternal youth due to golden apples. The story is taken from antiquity where a goddess is not worshipped well and she releases an angry boar on people of Calydonia. So virgin (she is painted by my friend Sophie by memory, red hair) Atalanta together with heroes conquer the boar. it symbolises social problems of Scotland, disagreements in political arena, bad management etc,

The Calydonian Boar hunt, 50×100, oil on canvas


Your Selection of Myths includes Ozma of Oz and there is a lot of Alchemical or Gnostic symbolism in the Oz books, and you studied alchemical symbolism



Yes. Ozma of Oz and Thyl Ullenspiegel, These are imaginary self-portraits. Thyl Ullenspiegel is a clown who lost his father, a knight templar, and goes around with ashes in a bottle, an owl and a mirror for others to see the truth. Ozma is again the good virgin. There is nothing connecting the two, just my favourite characters. Yes, just read Your previous comment. I depict a certain modern situation or character as a mythological creature or fable or as a gnostic archetype, which i see in a model as real life. All my paintings have models who inspired them, either with live sittings or by memory, i am saying inspired because I conceal facial distinction.

Self portrait as Ozma of OZ and Thyl Ulenspiegel 50 x 60cm, lead stick on paper


I studied alchemical symbolism with Adam MacLain, He lives in Glasgow and has a gallery and online school. I studied two online courses which I highly recommend and I met him in person at occult in Art conference in Cambridge, and we talked a lot on a train back.



Do you think of painting as part of an occult practice itself?



Yes. He also introduced me to the art world of Robert Lenkiewic who painted several thousand pieces without making any money and had a collection of 2000 alchemical texts. He is now dead, but due to him i got courage to move to big scale more of free movement colourful piece i studied for a year in Florence and they teach one source light imitating candle light. To Your question. Painting is a long process, and a finished piece is an alchemical initiation.



That’s an interesting way to phrase it


Natasha Kimstatsch and Ben Duax in conversation
Natasha Kimstatsch and Ben Duax in conversation


It takes lots and lots of research, and finding some clues. Might sound mad, but for example how I got the idea for Boar hunt. I found a shiny coin on an Edinburgh street, and when i went down to pick it up, i felt it is glued and is shiny from all people rubbing it, so i remembered the nose of boar in Florence which is shiny just like that and it struck like it is reaching out from Florence, so i read and researched the story. I have now moved to sculpture. I felt i needed to take some air after St Anthony, and am taking one-to-one studies in monumental sculpture, but currently am working on sketching the pose, it will be a highland Dancer in bronze



 It seems in line with your art historical references , interesting in Alchemy and so on


…the hands, they are carved in marble, called Prayer. They are my first not too good quality, but they were inspired by prayer hands by Durer, only they are flat turned in another position


The body is bronze and the hands are marble?In ancient Greece they’d have glass eyes in some of the statues or the stone Bhuddas in Bamiyan that had wooden faces that rotted away..



Marble and bronze are two different materials, so those are different works i was talking about. 

I was at short portrait class with University  of Washington summer school in Rome and we went to see a Vatican sculpter working on repairs of Perseus holding Medusa’s head. He said on dismantling there is lots of charcoal inside it, and tar. So they think the head of medusa was put on fire inside, so that marble eyes would shine.


I  ask everyone  who you consider to be under rated, like an artist who’s maybe overlooked 



Under-rated and everyone agrees is Robert Lenkiewitz, one can buy his painting now at flea marked for one hundred pounds, but he is really a vibrant, colourful, virile, i would say, individual.


Last thing- Is there something that you think of a guilty pleasure, like a bad artist or trash tv or whatever, that you love?


Paying a personal model for posing, That was guilty pleasure. The Wicker man is a cult classic, but the human sacrifice you might consider a cheesy part. old playboys for models, but is a classic as well- I once had an idea to go to a strip show, pay for entrance, and draw girls in motion.

See more of Natasha’s work Here 

interview by Benjamin Duax , June 2021



Based in the southside of Glasgow, Tess Glen is an alumni of the Edinburgh College of Art, and the Royal Drawing School.  She happened to be familiar with our name sake street and even knows a Mr. Butterbiggens.  Recently showing work at Salt Space in Glasgow and online as part of the Curated for Covid festival, Tess has an upcoming show at Six Foot Gallery in Glasgow, ‘Worship in the Neighbour’s House’. (May 7th-25th ’21) We spoke about the narrative elements of her work and the technical overlap between different mediums. Please click through for a short profile.


is there Really a  “Mr Butterbiggens”

Tess Glen

Haha, well he’s just a friend of a friend ,lives around the corner from me. I am interested in why the prize is named Butterbiggins though? it’s a great word

Tess Glenn's Portrait of Mr Butterbiggens
Mr Butterbiggens


After the hospital, but no real reason, I was told it was an old Scottish word for a dairy.  Daisy and Allison  streets are named after the daughters of the man who owned most of the land in Govanhill


I love these Glasgow street names, I’ve stolen the name Ardbeg for one of my characters in a comic I’m doing



 I wanted to ask you about comics ,the prints on your website have this very narrative quality, and even the paintings, look very intimate in scale ,like “New Yorker” comics almost



Oh well that is a big compliment thank you, I’ve always loved New Yorker cartoons, I used to have this great book of James Thurber cartoons that I loved but unfortunately the library asked for it back after 3 years

I think they influenced me a lot because they are very funny and you can’t quite put your finger on why, I aspire to that quality!

I was doing a lot of etching when I was at the drawing school, I always thought I was too impatient and slapdash for printmaking but actually I found etching to open up lots of new ideas for me. It forces you to slow down and really think about what you want to contain in a plate. It also makes you expect disappointment and work with it. I naturally work quite small and get lost in detail and pattern, because they are so time consuming you naturally begin to construct more of a narrative about what’s going on in the drawing



BB: What about the installation, where the plant is in relief on the wall?

T: That was a really big painting I was doing for a long time on a big sheet. I couldn’t make it work so I just cut out the individual elements and stuck them up. I  had totally forgotten about that installation, it’s good to be reminded because that often happens with a painting, I get to a point where just want to cut it up


 I wonder how you’ve been showing, and viewing work, if your consumption changed (with the various UK lockdowns)


It’s been hard i’ve really missed seeing physical work. I really enjoyed an exhibition put on by Mostyn Gallery called ‘My Online Bedroom’ ,it was this very cool and kitsch interior online that you could wander about in and view the work, it looked like you could see the sea in the distance behind the walls. The last irl exhibition i saw was John Byrne at the Glasgow printmakers, i was quite amazed by that and just how good he is at drawing, and funny too

BB: Is there anyone, a painter, or other artist, who you like who you think is kind of due for a critical revival?


T:I think it would be Hokusai’s for me. He’s not underrated but lots of people just look at his very famous prints like the wave. He did these catalogues where he tried to draw everything from species of birds to eating utensils, I really love the ones of figures stretching and fightingin terms of contemporary artists I would say an irish painter Eoin Mcevoy and Lana Svirezheva who lives in Hawaii.


you must have spent a lot of time in Museums, i saw these drawings you did of African masks


I find drawing from them is the only way i can really properly look at them because they are so mythologized and when you go to museums it can be very overwhelming to be surrounded by these objects you don’t know the context of, i think drawing from them is a way to learn and listen

BB:  Aside from artists who you think should be reconsidered, do you have any guilty pleasures?


T : Well, something that’s not really art but i think must have some influence on the characters i make up is watching a lot of obscure documentaries about ego maniac celebs

Madonna, Marco-Pierre White


 Marco Pierre-White, the chief?


He’s a very very complex man




to see more work: https://cargocollective.com/tessglen or on Instagram at @teddglen.

Interview April 21, by Ben Duax

Robert McCormack

Screen shot of html chat
Ben Duax and Robert Mcormack in Conversation

Robert McCormack

Robert Mcormack makes mostly black and white images blending abstraction and sentimental, almost thurberesque vignettes.  As part of his practice he creates custom mark making tools , such as charcoal paws and snouts, and big rubber tongues and animal busts for erasers.

BB With your work, there are conceptual questions, but I kind of want to ask  technical questions.

RM maybe that’s a better way in.

The process and physicality of it is so interesting, the paper wrapped around canvas seems like it would be so fragile.

Yes, it’s a nightmare actually ! I recently sold a work and it made me very nervous! but I really like playing with the idea of painting. I wanted them to signal paintings although there is no paint involved.When I show the works they are always leaning against the wall. I think I like to sort of rob painting of its authority or something or make fun of painting.

Black and white door size painting leaning against wall on painting blocks
Work By Robert McCormack

the fragility of the paintings  is reflected in the cast dog heads and paws–it reminds me a bit of Janine Antoni, who made busts of her head out of chocolate or soap

There is something entropic about them–I like the tools as much as the paintings and show them together. The paws become worn down the more they draw.

The paintings themselves have these kind of kitsch images like outlines of bones

black and white painting of abstract shapes including bones and teeth
Untitled work from 2020

There is something violent in that. I like to use imagery or subjects that’s a bit kitsch–dogs for example.

Something maybe debased? 

Well when I say violent I’m referring to the worn down paws but yes , perhaps debased is closer.

What do you use to bind the charcoal together? 

The charcoal mix took a while to get right. I tried crushing coal and all sorts but in the end I bashed up charcoal into powder and mixed it with dyed plaster.The mix has a consistency like porridge. and then I pour them into silicone moulds made from clay sculpted paws and heads.

A Charcoal marker in the shape of a dogs snout
Part of the production process

Is it a  specific dog? 

I suppose something closer to allegory. At the time I was thinking about how similar children and dogs were.I work in a school so I see a lot of reward and punishment driven practice and I would go home and make my dog do a trick for a treat.

The tongues are used as erasers, not as mark making instruments, there’s something kind of allegorical there, about language?

Yes I think so–something about dogs or children not being able to speak perhaps.

People talk about trying to draw like a child, like the elephants who they trained to paint

Yes I looked at these ! And apes !


cast dog heads dripping silicon
Custom tools for mark making


You’re going to be showing something as part of the open doors festival?

So I wont be showing anything I don’t think, but I am co-organising a show within the festival with another recent grad. We have 25 recent graduates looking to show. The festival will be operating in outdoor spaces and window spaces this year. A lot of traditional arts spaces will be playing catch up when things open up and so won’t be showing graduate work. So it’s pretty perfect timing. I like things that exist outside the institutions

Are there any other exhibitions you’ve seen recently that you really enjoyed, either in the november when things were open, or online, or in print 

The last work I saw in the flesh was at the Boros collection in Berlin. It’s a collection in a massive bunker.I saw some Avery Singers I really liked which I looked at a lot when making my final year’s work.  this place is only doing tours and you have to book months in advance but I really recommend it !

I snuck in once a few years ago and got on the german tour – didn’t know a word of German but just looked at the work. On the same trip I saw a tiny Cathy Wilkes painting on a plate.

Is there an artist you like, that you think is maybe due for a critical resurgence someone who either isn’t as well known as you think they should be or who is currently unfashionable

rubber dogs head used as a mark making device
A rubber dogs head, part of the creative process


Karen Killmnick I really love her work–her scatter installations are amazing with Sugar and things and her later paintings–I think she’s really underrated but is going through a bit of a resurgence. And one of my new favorites New York painter Joyce Pensato recently died–her work is starting to emerge a lot !

Do you know Pensato ?

I actually had no idea she died.

Yes she did this year I think… Love her work and her studio objects–these fucked up elmos walking around.

This cartoon specificity which then is sort of pushed back into conceptual abstraction through removing elements,

Yes it’s like a German expressionist got hooked on Disney


Biomorphic sculptures look like styized babies , in stone colour
Neonate, from 2019
plaster cast sculptures, distorted stuffed animal figures
Neonate, Work made on exchange at Emily Carr, in Canada, 2019

I ask people about an underrated artist but I also wanted to ask you if you’d tell us a “guilty pleasure” , something you really like, but that you think is uncool or lame

Well I was going to mention one of my tutors, Richard Walker,Did you know him?

The Guy who  paints with the lights out?

Yes, we got to go to his studio and saw him make these massive paintings – he cuts out shapes from the paintings and paints on them individually and then constructs the paintings. Eventually we saw a show of the finished works and I thought they were brilliant. I thought this show was pretty knockout he cuts the shapes out and paints on them he can brush through the forms and not stop something you can’t properly do another way I think

A guilty pleasure…Ok so the other day we did a kahoot with the kids. it’s like a quiz – anyway I discovered i’m really good with faces of actors and this comes from watching loads of trailers I think I see almost every trailer that comes out – never see the movie just the trailer And I like spotting actors from other trailers

Like Oh is that Jake Gyllenhaal or Tobey McGuire

I didn’t let the kids win the quiz haha like ah that guy is also in this thing !

 “The actor who played thor” or “That  guy from saw”

Yes haha – That’s so weird. 

See more work at https://robertmccormack.co.uk/

Interview by Ben Duax, February 2021

Emalia Mattia

Darlin’, 2020, acrylic and ink on paper, 42cm x 29.7cm



Starting the New Year with a profile of Emalia Mattia, who works in performance and painting, and is currently based in Glasgow. They met us online to speak about the specificity of the moment and how the work they make has changed in lockdown.


Hi Ben!

I’ve been doing them here as if it were asking people to met me at a cafe or a museum lobby

Oh I’m grateful soul, lol.


Emalia Matta and Ben Duax in conversation


Cool, Did you make this website? (refering to the chat room were we did the interview)

It was supposed to be a pop up show, my friends had group shows cancelled over the summer, and normally we would have had a show in a gas station bathroom or something, the back of a cafe, so I felt like we could do something with the same degree of formality-

It looks great, I have a real block with programming so I really admire anyone who can do it

It’s pretty simple in terms of the html

I’ve seen a couple of things online and I guess everyone is experimenting with different formats, this one feels good to me,some of them are like RPG style

Yeah RPG style, like MYST. Did you see the VR show that the GSA BFA did ?

(laughs) oh my god, Myst. I played Myst and never solved anything.

I did see that show, honestly going through 3-D rooms gives me vertigo, I find it very unsettling. That time was such a blur for me.

Kitchen painting, 2020, acrylic and ink on paper, 42cm x 29.7cm



– For everyone

Because i was dealing with so much heartbreak and frustration with GSA and constantly trying to have this line of communication with them

How have you been seeing work, or showing work?

I’ve seen 2 IRL shows since lockdown began, both of which made me feel very emotional. “Shoving from all sides” at platform 2020 , in Edinburgh , I really loved seeing work by two people I know, Susannah Stark and Rabindranath A Bhose. Maybe because I’ve seen their work develop over the past 2 years.

You were on the same course as them?

No, I just know them in Glasgow. 

There is something more special about making an appointment, having to wear a mask, and so on.

Yes it feels more intentional. It feels special to see someone’s work in the flesh. also, in Milan Trisha Baga’s show “the eye, the eye and the ear” at Hangar Bicocca ,which is a massive space

The show covered 15 years of her work, it was so MUCH ,these big video installs , It was a little overwhelming ,after not seeing work for a long time. We just spent hours in there

Trisha Baga would really be kind of perfect for this moment, because her work is at this intersection of screen and physical object

Yeah definitely, many layers. It almost felt interactive, different videos were different outcomes of the same rpg game adventure to me.

 9 Pound Hammer, Performance 2019



How have you been sending your work into the world these days? you were doing zines before and that doesn’t seem like it would have to change much, but performances are kind of limited.

I made a pretty drastic change with covid, because I was focussing mainly on performance , Painting and drawing has been something I go back to sometimes, but in particular last year while I was doing the MLitt I had a lot of ideas for performance. I was really interested in organizing live events in Glasgow. That all fell through obviously.

Queen of Diamonds, 2019, acrylic on paper, 293cm x 217cm



Making smaller things to sell has been a focus for me, I filter most things through social media

That allows you to select an audience?

Or that changes the audience, it’s still self selecting, but in a different way than people who would come to a performance.

There is a coherent visual language though, your 2D work has similar imagery even something as basic as like, some of the characters having the same haircut as you.

Yeah exactly, I like self portraiture. A running theme for me would be movement, for sure, but also how using your own image becomes this abstraction of self. When I started painting again during lockdown, specifically all the “Pastoral” paintings I think I was speaking to people who would follow me on social media, trans people in my circle. I knew that they would get it, and it felt like some kind of intimacy.

With live performance people beyond the extensions of my social scene would be there but because we’re all experiencing this at this same time it feels like I can control it more.

People are kind of primed to see things as a specific historic moment or having increased gravity.

I do find a lack of audience now frustrating, I have done an online show but honestly I find that very dissatisfying. The experience of not getting a degree show was a major heartbreak.

Someone told me that it’s a bit like a badge of honour or more like a crystallization experience people will read that list of twenty people or whatever , from each institution, more closely than the year before , or the first year back.

Like an online degree show people would look more closely at the artists, or a post covid IRL degree show?

 I don’t mean the specific exhibition , I mean like a register,there is this plaque at the basement of (the Glasgow School of Art) of all the students who died in World War 1

Oh Lord ,Wonder where it is in the new building.When I was in Edinburgh I saw an exhibition with paintings from that time From Scottish painters, it was a couple floors below the platform show

What were they like?

Maybe this is going off on a tangent but there have been a lot of comparisons between now and that time, early 1900s,because of the spanish flu. The paintings felt like they were a bit outdated for their time? Like there was futurism going on and they were very sweet nature paintings ,portraits of women taking baths. Scotland feels so remote sometimes, maybe that’s why I haven’t seen a lot of portrayals of covid life in art.

Almost none, not in fashion photography or anything that’s mediated.

Though I did watch a few episodes of the Kardashians because it shows them dealing with the beginning of covid

Are there specific visual reference to paintings that I might be missing or other art historical references , like the drawing of the sword swallower

Weep not!,  2020, acrylic and ink on paper, 42cm x 29.7cm


I went to a vocational high school in italy and we were trained to do frescoes, decorating and some light art restoration .So I had to paint a lot of early renaissance and medieval reproductions.

The Judds, 2020, acrylic and ink on canvas, 107 cm x 72 cm


That imagery is my main influence, medieval concepts of space ,weep not, a lot of the phrases I use I steal from religious music, country music.

Two final cheesy questions; is there anyone, could be a visual artist, or someone else, who you think is underrated and due to be rediscovered, someone who is forgotten who you would like to bring back and the other question is, can you share with us a “guilty pleasure” something that you think is lame or stupid, but nonetheless love

Gosh the first one is hard , I think there are so many artists that are underrated or just don’t get that much exposure I really love the artists Keijuan Thomas and Sandra Johnston ,They’re both performance artists who make incredible work and definitely aren’t known enough, I saw both of their work in Birmingham last year and really changed how I think about performance As for the guilty pleasure, This is really boring but I love ambient TV.

like the fireplace video?

TV that’s in the background, but a specific kind of TV that you don’t have to follow that much, Like reality tv – just always playing and everything is very horizontal

Real housewives?

Real Housewives, old ones too, like Anna Nicole Smith ,interior decorating shows.

Thank you for speaking with us

Thanks for the chat!

interview by Ben Duax, December 2020

Megan Chapman

Yesterday’s parties
mixed media on 200gsm acid-free paper
42×59.4cm/16.5×23.4″ ©2020 Megan Chapman

Edinburgh based Megan Chapman spoke to us about shifting the scale of her work during quarantine, choosing an audience and the three dimensionality of her work. Please keep reading for a short interview.

Hello Megan! How are you?

Hello, Ben! I am well thanks. How are you?
I like the concept of being interviewed in a chat. It’s how so many of us communicate these days anyway.

This is How We Tell The Story
mixed media on 200gsm acid-free paper
42×59.4cm/16.5×23.4″ ©2020 Megan Chapman

It’s nice because there is more of a vernacular affect, last month the interview (with the Kirkwood Brothers)  has some “aye” and “wee” that probably wouldn’t have made it if it was an email interview.

Yes, I saw that. Yes, had a nice feeling.

Megan Chapman and Ben Duax in conversation

I was wondering how you have been looking at art these past six months or so, if any online shows that you appreciated or social distanced shows?

Well, I feel inundated with art online. I get quite overwhelmed with it all on social media. Facebook, instagram, twitter. I have seen at least one or two formal exhibitions online. The Paisley Institute exhibition was online and done quite well. I had a couple of pieces in it and I was very interested how they would create an experience. I think they really succeeded. I also caught one exhibition in person when the numbers were lower this summer by Edinburgh artist and friend Karl Macrae and everything was socially distanced and very well run and it was lovely to be out and see art again.

Resilience factory
mixed media on 200gsm acid-free paper
42×59.4cm/16.5×23.4″ ©2020 Megan Chapman

Someone told me that we had to learn to look through screens instead of at them. The work you sent us, all from 2020? It has a real sense of depth, of layers, almost like animation frames or collages.

As far as how I am processing images, while overwhelming and different online it is still wonderful to see so much work, it seems to me many artists have been quite prolific during this time. Yes, all the work I sent you is from 2020 and is part of a 13 piece series called “This is how we tell the story” all on paper done from the corner of my living room as I have not  been working in my studio in Leith. I have had to adapt my work to my surroundings, so the work has become more drawn, using conte crayon, charcoal, pastel, and paint. Thanks about the layers. Yes, there was a sense of depth created in the layering of the different media as I worked.

It also looks a bit “lighter” , not it terms of colours but in terms of how dense the images are, compared to some of the stuff on your site. Some of your work from around five years ago is a bit more anthropomorphic these look like faces to me.

I like how you see the works, collage and animation. Ha! Yes, good catch- much lighter. Enjoying working on paper, feeling less pressure, less precious. When you visit my site you see my paintings on canvas from my larger bodies of work more likely to be shown in galleries, I don’t often put my smaller works or works on paper there. I have two worlds for my art in a way. Yes, the 2015 work, quite hot in colour – a delicate balance – finding my way back to colour after turning my back on it for a while during my “white series”days in the years previous.

The new works are more drawn, illustrative almost – they look good flat (on your screens) but then they do have places you can wander into. I love to create spaces that folks can go into and hopefully let go of the world for a bit.

False dynasties
mixed media on 200gsm acid-free paper
42×59.4cm/16.5×23.4″ ©2020 Megan Chapman

You also  sold a painting to be used in a television show?

I sold 3 prints from a body of work that was done on paper and was not be viewed by the public due to the fragility of the paper and the work. It was more of a personal exercise for me. But, then I ended up really enjoying where some of the pieces went and prints were made – The HBO show True Detective bought the three prints to use in the last series of the show. I only clocked one of them on the tv but I must say it was a thrill.

A bit of an interesting thing to see them inside someone elses constructed reality, no?

Constructed reality – yes. I think this is something that is needed. For me the benefit of art is where it takes me and what it shows me and how I can feel new states and learn about myself and the world. I want to share that feeling with viewers of my work.

How important is context for you? What do you want the viewer to come to the work with? for example, Would you rather the viewer not read your bio?

Under the surface
mixed media on 200gsm acid-free paper
42×59.4cm/16.5×23.4″ ©2020 Megan Chapman

Well, I want the viewer to be as present as can be in order to receive the work but I know that is often not the case. I know that often viewers spend seconds looking at a painting. I find this a bit heart breaking, so I try to make it easier for them. I might lead them into the work with a title. Like a bread crumb trail. I will give them things they understand first and then hopefully they can relax a bit and feel safe enough to come into the work and stay a while. I don’t mind if they skip my bio. I really want them to come into the painting. Read that later if they want more.

Right- A bread crumb trail

I love making the work but then I really love when people connect with the work. Especially abstract art. I want to level the playing field and make it accessible. There are things to go back and look at, like more identifiable shapes.

Bowls or objects

Yes, there are these organic shapes that they will recognise. Brains can make sense of if need be. I know that abstract work can be hard for people to engage with so there are these little anchors within the painting. There are plot points, or notes like music to help pull the viewer along.

To be left untethered
mixed media on 200gsm acid-free paper
42×59.4cm/16.5×23.4″ ©2020 Megan Chapman

Yes, Entryways.

Yes, exactly. I think because most of us are comfortable with the written word from an early age. It takes our guard down where as art can feel confrontational to some. I am happy for that to happen too, but really I want people to have an experience. I know many don’t have the time and won’t allow themselves the chance to feel the work.

I asked you earlier about what you’ve seen recently. Are there any visual artists who you think are due for a critical revival. The other question I wanted to ask was if you could share with us a guilty pleasure, something you think is lame or stupid that you nonetheless love very much.

Well, I think women artists are underated. I know that is a blanket statement and I know that many museums and galleries are doing better and giving more exhibitions to women and people of colour. I think that’s well deserved and about time. I don’t even yet know the names of the artists that are due for a critical renaissance, but they are out there, and I want to see their work. All the artists I could name drop are doing pretty well in the exposure department at least.

As far as guilty pleasure… I am no royalist but I devoured all 4 seasons of The Crown in a very short period of time and was sort of shocked at myself but enjoyed the hell out of it.

Fair about women artists, and perhaps especially women painters

Yes, as a painter. I think it is very fair. Painting is still considered a man’s world in many respects.

Anyway, thank you Megan.

Thank you. Take care.

Kirkwood Brothers

Selected Small paintings by the Kirkwood Brothers

Our artists this month are Brothers from Glasgow, Jonny and Jordon  Kirkwood. Working collaborativly, they make paintings, sculptures, zines and posters about mental health, scottish identity, japanese cartoons , and other interesting things. Jonny Kirkwood agreed to meet me for an online chat to talk about the work they make.

 Jonny met me at http://www.lite-of-worlds.ca/
Ben Duax and Jonny Kirkwood in Conversation

Thanks for joining me

No worries! Thanks for having me

 I was thinking I could ask you about a few specific pieces you’ve posted or included in your email, but first i was wondering if you’d talk a little about your process as a collaborator

Cat in a bucket

yeah sure, just fire the questions over. Our collaboration started quite a while ago. Obviously Jordon is my brother so it’s been life long but I started making art about Autism way back when I studied at college. Then I sort of started going off in another direction during art school at first. Before long though I realised there was something there between me and my brother where this pretty rich work was getting made. So it just turned into a really natural way of making work while chatting away in the studio.

its interesting to collaborate on a physical object, or a specific visual project, its less as opposed to an installation or a narrative piece

Yeah we quite often work on the same piece of paper or canvas at the same time. Right now there’s a bit more going back and forth, but we’ve weirdly been making even more work than usual.

the same canvas, like on opposite ends? have you ever looked at the work of the CoBRA artists? they worked on collaborative paintings as a sort of marxist gesture, but there are a few examples the basquiat and warhol collaborations for example,or those twin brothers from “spring breakers”

Aye well we done that once, like sat a big canvas down then kept rotating it till it was covered ha but mostly we just lean over each other or take turns. Yeah, I looked into it a lot while in my last year at art school. There’s also these Dundee based brothers that I liked a lot too, I think it was Brownlee Brothers? And Basquiat is definitely one I always come back to for a little inspiration

Brownlee Brothers, I will look that up

They deep fried a sword, that was me sold on them.

 Something like the lady in the lake giving king arthur the sword? or like the inversion of the sword being forged Kind of something to do with Scottish identity? 

Yeah! they fried it in batter. I guess I’ve always liked playing on that Scottish identity theme too so I’m drawn to work that works with it.

I saw the photo of your Maw with “Maw” written in sharpie

like not “mum” not “mom”

haha Aye she was surprisingly really up for helping us with that photograph. Less than impressed when she found out we were using it for an exhibition

A Portrait of the Brothers Mother

I also wanted to ask about dispersion, your  work is kind of suited to social media, I guess because of the scale and also the content has sort of hooks for the audience , pop culture references.

Aye I used to be quite naive with social media but I’ve really looked into how platforms like Instagram work, it really suits our work. There’s usually so much of it that it sort of needs condensed, it also fits nicely with that fast and furious finger swiping. Quite often I’ll try and tie the posts in with what’s going on in the media or other times I just throw it out there.

Work by the Kirkwood Brothers

You’ve also made zines and done zine workshops, which is kind of a similar way of prioritizing content or the speed of dispersion?

Zines were a way for us to filter our smaller drawings, the ones that might be cast to the side. they also really help us to understand narratives in the work

More Narrative Work

What about the missing parakeet poster?

That’s actually based on our Mum “accidentally” leaving our veranda door open when we were wee. We had a budgie called Dude who was honestly possessed by Satan, One day we came in and he was sitting on the tree outside our flat. My mum swears it was a mistake but I’ve always had my suspicions..

painting of the Brothers pet parekeet Budgie

Are there any  exhibitions or publications that you’ve seen recently that really impressed you? like in glasgow or anywhere, people are looking at art online a lot these days so could be anywhere really

I’ve not actually been to an exhibition in a long time. I guess it’s mostly been online that I’ve been looking at work. I always come back to artists like Kentaro Okawara and Misaki Kawai. Okawara tends to have symbols or characters that appear in his work a lot and that’s something I’ve come to realise about our own practice. There’s a lot of repetitive patterns

I’ve actually really enjoyed seeing all the murals that keep popping up in Glasgow. There’s a real street art scene coming to fruition

Do you have anything else on the horizon? 

We’ve got a few things in the works, an exhibition coming up in England that’s really exciting and then some work showing in SaltSpace in Glasgow . Then a few other wee social media features here and there.

Great one last question i’ve been asking everyone, is can you tell us about a guilty pleasure something you really like, but think is dumb/embarrising

There’s so many! We still watch a lot of cartoons. Like this morning I watched Pokemon while eating cereal in my boxers. It’s definitely a guilty pleasure at the age of 28. I also try my hardest not to care so much about football. But it almost feels ingrained, it’s something I’ll often say is really daft but can’t shake off.

haha great,

Well thank you for joining me

Thanks so much! This is a great way of interviewing, was pretty relieved when I realised it was this and not zoom!!

yeah i can’t handle zoom, it removes the elegant thing about text based interaction which is that either party can pause it to some degree

Aye I definitely need pauses. Not the best at articulating my thoughts when I’m speaking on camera. 

Check out the Kirkwood Brothers on Instagram

interview by Ben Duax.